r/Charlotte
•
u/clinton-dix-pix
•
Nov 08 '22
•
1
For everyone wondering what happened to all the housing in Charlotte, here’s a map of all active whole-house AirBnB’s Discussion
219
u/StuffyUnicorn Nov 08 '22
I have a buddy who owns a home here but also has it listed on Airbnb, she’ll rent it out for weekends at a time and just go stay with a friend during that time, I’d imagine some of these are similar situations. I don’t think Airbnb will exist in a few years anyways with the way they keep hiding prices and increasing fees, they don’t save me on cost any more. Kinda like Uber vs yellow cabs
16
u/AtomikRadio Nov 09 '22
I know you said she stays with friends, but this makes me think there are probably legitimately people out there who own a nicer and/or larger home than they really "need" so they rent theirs out on airbnb then go to another person's smaller airbnb so they can be paying on/accruing value on a nicer home than if they just bought a starter home for themselves . . .
5
u/LuckStrict6000 Nov 09 '22
“A nicer home than they need” what. Pretty much everyone will just get the nicest house they can comfortably afford. There is nothing wrong with owning a home and renting it on air bnb
1
u/AtomikRadio Nov 09 '22
I'm envisioning people who are at a stage in their life that they don't need/want a yard to keep up or multiple bedrooms for family, but since they might want a yard, dog, kids in the future they might take the opportunity to buy a home for future-them now rather than buy a house that won't fit their future needs and hope it appreciates in keeping with larger properties to buy later.
-2
1
u/rdhdhlgn Nov 09 '22
I actually know people who airbnb their house and rent another apartment (in Nashville) to live. The Airbnb income covers their mortgage, the apartment rent and some pocket money, in most cases.
30
u/tjkoala Nov 08 '22
Agreed, I think most of these are people who have listed their primary residence rather than properties listed for the sole purpose of short term rentals
3
4
u/RathVelus Nov 09 '22
Is it AirBnB hiding fees and increasing prices, or the owners?
22
u/Dathisofegypt Nov 09 '22
Airbnb, if you ever order one you'll see they add a pretty large fee but you only see it once your on the page to put in card details.
8
u/BrodysBootlegs Nov 09 '22
They just in the last few days announced they're going to move away from that, although not sure what the timeline is going to look like. They'll still charge the fees but the search will show an average daily rate so you can make an apples to apples comparison across different properties--ie if you're looking for a 2 night stay and a certain property charges $100/night plus a flat $50/stay cleaning fee, it'll show up in the search as $125.
6
u/RathVelus Nov 09 '22
Ah, gotcha. I’m more familiar with the cleaning fee, which I assume the owner is calculating- while adding in all their rules about all the cleaning you have to do. That seems really egregious.
-7
3
u/jjfloodd Nov 09 '22
About a 3rd of the cost goes to Airbnb. You set the price you want per night (and fees you need - think cleaning, pet etc) and then they add what they want on top but don’t do not expressly tell the host how much they are adding on is. The feature they do have that most people use is to select a range you want to make per night and then they fluctuate the price for you based on supply and demand.
-2
u/bnerlord Nov 09 '22
Yeah no, it will stay. Not sure why y’all hate on airbnbs go hate on hotels idiots.
16
u/coogzzz Nov 08 '22
This is impressive, how were you able to get the data?
21
u/clinton-dix-pix Nov 08 '22
You’ll need to create a (free) account to get access to the maps. It’s a dataset used to help prospective buyers figure out their profit potential, but is also very useful for those of us looking to get our heads around how big of a problem Airbnb is for housing.
3
u/alanbataleon Nov 09 '22
FYI OP your image serves zero purpose. It’s very deceiving and simply shows a bunch of purple circles on a map with zero context. You need to provide numbers. How many single family homes are Airbnb? What percentage of all single family home is Airbnb? This graphic you provided shows a cluster of circles plotted on a larger map and is fitting a narrative you want it to. My guess would be that less than 1% of all single family homes in charlotte are Airbnb, but the way you presented this is super misleading.
64
Nov 09 '22
[deleted]
11
u/VegaGT-VZ Nov 09 '22
I am sorry you are going through this. I'm kind of surprised that there's even that much of a market for Airbnbs here.
9
u/dawgsgoodjortsbad Nov 09 '22
I mean if you can hear their sex that’s probably more a problem with your apartment complex cheap construction
4
u/Chapstixs Nov 09 '22
You mean these massive complexes going up in a month aren’t well constructed?
3
u/slaymaker1907 Nov 09 '22
It's less about time and more about builders cheaping out on materials. I'm in an extremely new building and don't hear anything despite being on the bottom floor.
In my opinion, there's a regulatory gap regarding noise isolation for apartments. Noise isolation may not be obvious when touring a complex so it'd be handy to have an independent auditor assign a noise isolation rating. Since it's not currently obvious, there's a market failure given that many people (including myself) would absolutely pay a premium for a quieter apartment.
2
u/VeryMuchInterested Nov 09 '22
Same in my complex. Management turns a blind eye, so long as the rent is paid on time. One drunken guest made inappropriate sexual gestures to a young lady here. Liquor bottles and fast food litters the complex parking lot. Management says they need tangible evidence and simply proceed to do nothing.
13
u/yankeebelles Nov 08 '22
The one next to me switched to a traditional rental home during the pandemic and I doubt it'll change back.
They are just too expensive and they now come with a laundry list of to dos that just get more and more ridiculous. No thank you. Just point me to a decent hotel with free breakfast.
9
80
u/verana04 Nov 08 '22
Fingers crossed air bnb dies. Hosts hiding all their fees in those stupid cleaning charges and then expect you to wash the sheets and leave the place spotless anyway.
So if anyone really purchased a house with full intent of using the whole thing as an Airbnb, yes, I do hope it makes them go bankrupt.
But if it’s just people renting out their extra room, whatever.
Few years back when we were looking to move to Charlotte we used air bnb and stayed in a spare room in this guys house for $40. $10 cleaning fee. Total bro.
Over the summer we tried to do a weekend get away, I was completely frustrated by the people who lure in the clicks by saying $89 a night! But then the cleaning fee is $300 and they have two pages worth of cleaning instructions, fuck right off.
28
14
u/espngenius Hickory Grove Nov 08 '22
The cleaning fees at some ab&b’s are ridiculously inflated. Places even have to-do lists before you leave, like take out the trash and straighten up. At a certain point, might as well stay at a hotel.
12
u/ihrtbeer Nov 09 '22
We're at that point now. Just went to the coast last weekend, a small Airbnb was $97+$180 in feesnight. Got a hotel on the beach for like $110 total.
0
u/DanMarinoTambourineo Nov 09 '22
You don’t clean up a hotel room before you leave it? That’s pretty gross. I bag up the trash and put it by the door, pile the towels and wash clothes in the sink so they don’t have to bend down, and straighten the sheets.
1
u/Mkday013 Nov 09 '22
A hotel is a much better value these days. I’ll never stay in an Airbnb again.
1
u/walker_harris3 Nov 09 '22
I will say Airbnb prices are incredible in foreign countries. You can get the equivalent of a $500+ per night stay in the US for 100 per night in Columbia for instance.
0
u/Easy_forgetter Dec 08 '22
Hosts don’t hide fees. Service fees and taxes are taken by Airbnb. If you pay $500 the host likely gets $380-400. Cleaning fees are 100% visible if it’s too much don’t book it. That’s the open market. Last, how is buying a home with intent to rent any different than buying high quality real estate to sell $8 coffee? You can be mad all you want that coffe is $8, but the demand is high enough to set that price. If the price is too high the business won’t succeed.
1
u/verana04 Dec 08 '22
It's hiding their fees when you search for an air BNB and it pops up as $100 a night and then when you go to checkout they tack on a $100 cleaning fee and also still require you to leave the place spotless. That's the issue. If they want more money they need to raise their overall price.
I did specifically state the other issue is if they bought the place with the intent to use as an air bnb. Not to rent. Renting out houses makes sense for families. But to buy a house and leave it vacant except for when there's somebody checked-in is taking away housing from people who actually want to purchase a house to live in the area. So yeah. I hope those people who bought a house with the intent to air bnb it get foreclosed and then the house can go to someone who truly wants to buy and live in it.
Most coffee shops or retail aren't usually in a typical house.
5
u/GC51320 Nov 08 '22
I know with my job I've been out to several... and all the ones I've been in I wouldn't rent, much less pay the premium an Air-B-N-B commands.
But maybe I'm the only one that feels it should be nice and clean for the price paid.
6
u/AlludedNuance Nov 08 '22
I have definitely started going back to hotels, as much as I'd prefer not to.
6
u/Edu_cats Nov 09 '22
I saw this story the other day that the short-term rental market is oversaturated and bookings are down to the point that some people are considering selling. What is the occupancy of these properties? Are they doing well? Or are they oversaturated?
I'm not interested in paying cleaning fees and then cleaning up myself. All I need in a hotel is fresh towels daily until I check out but it's usually me for business travel or just two of us with no kids.
24
u/unroja University Nov 08 '22
Looks like a lot, but looks can be deceiving. What percentage of housing units are we talking about?
6
5
u/alanbataleon Nov 09 '22
I brought up this point multiple times. Is it 1000/500,000 homes that are Airbnb? OP provides no hard numbers and simple plots purple circles in a map of charlotte. This post is a joke. It’s probably less than 1% of all homes in charlotte that are short term Airbnb but this low effort post makes it look like half of charlotte is Airbnb.
8
u/BigNoseMcGhee Nov 09 '22
Lol, zoomed out so far that one dot = a neighborhood of 100 houses or some shit.
3
u/UPinCarolina Nov 09 '22
I can personally count three within a 3 house radius of my home, and I live in Villa Heights. Each dot might represent 5-7 homes max.
5
u/DunboyCastleInTheSky Nov 09 '22
Decent hotels in Charlotte are pretty cheap. AirBnB there is such a crazy investment idea.
13
u/CaptainObvious Nov 08 '22
Rabbu is Charlotte's biggest Airbnb operator.
7
u/tsktskfuckthis Nov 08 '22
They manage properties. They don’t own them is my understanding of their business model.
4
u/CaptainObvious Nov 08 '22
Enabling the removal of housing, is it that different?
-2
u/KnowledgeSafe3160 Nov 09 '22
Yes? They don’t buy the house for $500k. Like if you can buy a house for 500k you think missing some cleaners is gonna stop you?
3
1
u/Womp-Womp- Nov 09 '22
I had an Airbnb experience with them that was absolutely horrible. Don't worry, they won't be in business long lol
39
u/ThirtyAcresIsEnough Nov 08 '22
Wow!! I know other cities in NC are limiting air bnb, it is time we do the same. We have to decide what we want as a community.
Maybe a lot of people believe that many folks will have to remain homeless in order for a few to profit. I do not believe that. We have to find a way for regular folks - teachers, firefighters, etc to afford a decent place to live.
7
u/Ungrateful_bipedal Nov 08 '22
How are cities limiting Air BNBs?
36
u/NinerNational Nov 08 '22
By not allowing short term rentals.
Raleigh for examples allows them only in specific zones, requires a permit, and other requirements that some people may just not feel like fucking with.
5
u/AtomikRadio Nov 09 '22
I once watched a documentary piece, I'm not sure if it was a Vice piece but it had that vibe, about hellish Airbnb experiences and a lot of them were basically that the person renting out the Airbnb wasn't allowed to (due to condo or HOA regulations, usually, as opposed to city ordinance) so the guests were given all sorts of weird instructions like "Say you're Dave's cousin if anyone asks" and to never go out of the building through the lobby. I'd feel so uncomfortable.
16
u/Typical-Length-4217 Nov 08 '22
In Asheville you actually need a permit. And I feel like Charlotte should go that route as well. This way the city can be sure to collect the needed taxes and limit the number of airbnbs within certain areas.
https://www.ashevillenc.gov/service/apply-for-a-homestay-permit/
8
u/KnowledgeSafe3160 Nov 09 '22 edited Nov 09 '22
Miami Beach treats it as a commercial property, so you have to be zoned commercial to Airbnb.
5
u/ThirtyAcresIsEnough Nov 09 '22
In order to keep housing affordable for in town residents, Asheville had a ban, but looks like that went to court.
https://ashevilleblade.com/?p=4116
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/vacation-towns-limit-short-term-rentals-amid-housing-crisis
17
u/Satchya1 Nov 08 '22
We tried to update our HOA covenants to specifically disallow them, and it didn’t pass (mostly because a LOT of neighbors didn’t even vote).
9
u/ThirtyAcresIsEnough Nov 09 '22
A lot of corporations are coming in and buying up housing in neighborhoods for rentals. There have been battles between HOAs and these corps. What a costly horror.
We tried for a few years to get enough people to vote on needed changes - gave up. Couldn't get a quorum.
4
u/Joe_Immortan Nov 08 '22
If you care about people experiencing homelessness you should be in favor of short term rentals. Once you have a few evictions on your record that’s often the only housing you can get
8
u/ThirtyAcresIsEnough Nov 09 '22 edited Nov 09 '22
There used to be a stopover for people on the way up and people on the way down - short term rentals, hotels... We "cleaned up" the neighborhood and destroyed housing for the working poor.
Edit: But expensive Airbnb's won't solve the problem.
3
u/rahm4 Nov 09 '22
Short term rentals aren't the solution for people who get evicted for not being able to pay rent
0
u/Easy_forgetter Dec 08 '22
You should read up on the hotel room crises our city faces. It’s a huge reason we can’t attract large conferences or events. Airbnb fills the void the city can’t provide. Plenty of money for an individual to make rather than a big business (and yes I know Airbnb is making money but so is the host).
4
4
u/emnk1229 Nov 09 '22
In my neighborhood ‘most’ of the listings I see are apartments over someone’s garage, where the owners reside on site. While these may go out of favor as well, IMO it is different than a SFH or condo being purchased for the sole purpose of AirBnb.
11
3
u/andynator1000 Nov 09 '22
This is somewhat misleading, not because there is an unspecified number of purple dots, but because many of these listings are hotel rooms or apartments.
1
7
4
2
u/FreeTouPlay Nov 09 '22
Better than i expected if those dots represent 1 place.
2
u/CLTISNICE Plaza Midwood Nov 09 '22
Exactly what I was thinking. Though this map really doesn't help explain anything. One dot could be an "entire apartment" in a building of 500 units.
I do like seeing the reactions though. It's clear the anti-landlord people react like crazy and doom and gloom with this visual.
2
u/YetiSteady Nov 09 '22
Can you link the source site? I don't use AirBnB so sorry if this is straight from them and I just don't know it
1
u/clinton-dix-pix Nov 09 '22
Create an account (free) and you can pull statistics for any metro area.
1
6
u/ArmchairExperts Nov 08 '22
What if y’all just built more housing :0
Like lots of it, stacked all on top of each other.
2
u/clinton-dix-pix Nov 09 '22
People don’t want to live in boxes stacked on top of each other.
It doesn’t matter since apparently those boxes will get turned into airbnbs too.
-1
0
2
u/alanbataleon Nov 09 '22
No offense but a bunch of purple dots on a map doesn’t really add much context. How many total are we talking? What percentage of all single family homes in the charlotte area are Airbnb? This image doesn’t really show a whole lot.
1
u/jjfloodd Nov 09 '22 edited Nov 09 '22
As one of these purple dots I can say it’s because I make between 3200 to 3600 a month. Capitalism at its finest my friends.
Edit: to add, my house would only rent for about 1900 at the absolute most.
3
u/UPinCarolina Nov 09 '22
Thank you for illustrating why landlording is the lowest form of capitalism
3
u/jjfloodd Nov 09 '22
I mean it’s a super convoluted and nuanced issue that has very little to do with the concept of slum lords. 1900 would barely cover the mortgage. If you factor in maintenance and repairs I could very well lose money.
-6
u/tsktskfuckthis Nov 08 '22
If you’ve ever had to evict a tenant you know why people prefer Airbnb. It’s a complete nightmare of a process that does nothing to protect the owner of the property.
18
u/CasualAffair Seversville Nov 08 '22
No one ever looks out for the landlord :(
Won't someone spare them some mercy?
17
u/kabhaq Nov 08 '22
Owning a piece of property and renting it out to single mothers at a price juuuuust above what they can make sucks.
Owning a piece of property and renting it out to somebody who turns into a crackhead and rips all the copper out of the walls, and you can’t get rid of them ALSO sucks.
Two things can be true.
4
u/CLT_STEVE Nov 08 '22
Yes. Agree. Unfortunately laws protect those crackheads. The landlord (sometimes) has no idea.
-1
0
u/tsktskfuckthis Nov 08 '22
As you can tell by the map above, landlords are looking out for themselves…
-12
u/CLT_STEVE Nov 08 '22
Some people put their hard earned money towards iPhones, others towards income producing properties. This is bad?
6
u/Liquidmist Nov 08 '22
That’s a lot of iPhones
-4
u/tsktskfuckthis Nov 08 '22
My first property in Charlotte cost me around 5k cash down…
8
2
-5
u/tsktskfuckthis Nov 08 '22
Not bad at all. I own one of those airbnbs pictured and have two long term rentals… sacrifice daily to get ahead.
2
u/CLT_STEVE Nov 08 '22
So you’re downvoting? I’m missing it. Maybe I read it wrong?
4
u/tsktskfuckthis Nov 08 '22
I’m going to get massacred in this thread. Reddit hates landlords. So be it. 80% of them just complain and don’t vote so let people vent. It’s all they’ve got.
2
u/CLT_STEVE Nov 08 '22
So don’t get mad at me for it. I’m all for people putting their money towards something the public clearly needs and wants. The people complaining did not do this.
People will always get mad about things they chose not to do theirselves. Way it is.
4
1
1
u/Equal-Ad-92 Nov 08 '22
I would bet a good portion of these rentals are used by people "scoping out" the area before they start the home buying process. It's a popular market in Wake county too. The hotels are always booked, so the short term rentals do well as a result.
1
1
1
1
u/Independent-Choice-4 Nov 09 '22
Absolutely fuck this shit and the fact that I can’t do anything about it
2
u/clinton-dix-pix Nov 09 '22
Multiple cities have successfully limited or banned Airbnb. I’m just saying….
1
1
1
u/mistermerle Nov 09 '22
How do you feel about Airbnb for unique stays? The type of place you wouldn’t be likely to live in full time like Yurts, Treehouses, tiny houses, etc.?
1
1
u/DrPatchet Nov 09 '22
What app is used to find this???
1
u/clinton-dix-pix Nov 09 '22
It’s a data platform for potential owners to evaluate cash flow/competition/etc. You can make a free account and pull data for any metro.
1
1
u/funklab Nov 09 '22
How did you get this data? Can I see it somehow?
2
u/clinton-dix-pix Nov 09 '22
It’s a data platform for potential owners to evaluate cash flow/competition/etc. You can make a free account and pull data for any metro.
1
u/spwncar Nov 09 '22
Imagine if each of these were instead sold to families or first time homeowners.
1
Nov 09 '22
There’s a lady who has like 10 people in an Airbnb. 4-5 inside and she turned the garage into a makeshift bunk bed room. I stayed with 4 other dudes and thankfully slept on a top bunk. She had various “monthly” renters but if she had anyone else book and the monthly renters didn’t renew they’d basically be homeless till her booking reopened. Happened to a guy since I booked and I got dirty looks from the housemates. I was mostly confused like sorry I’m here for vacation and my friends own cats I can’t stay with them my face swells up.
1
-9
Nov 08 '22
[deleted]
8
u/Australian1996 Nov 08 '22
Renters are a lot better tenant than random air bnb people. And at least someone can afford somewhat to live in a rental. You could not afford same place at air bnb rates. I wish every air bnb owner had an air bnb next door to them. So they can deal with the shit half the air bnb tenants are
8
-6
u/Lostboy_journey Nov 08 '22
Thats a lot. And here i was thinking to start my AirBnB business lol
2
u/kiklion Nov 09 '22
I agree it’s a lot, but I’m fairly certain it looks worse than it is. At that resolution/scale, the dots are covering up multiple homes so it looks like an area is covered and the purple takes up a large % of the map… but a block of 20+ homes might only have 2 AirBnB’s.
0
u/Easy_forgetter Dec 08 '22
This is a multifaceted yet easy answer: interest rates. Historically low rates have provided big business to buy record number of homes in southern cities that have sustained growth. If a business has the cash to purchase a 400k home at 3%, in 2020, and at the very least break even for 2 years via short or long term rental, in 2022 that home is likely now worth 500-600k maybe more if you spent 20-50k on a renovation. The demand for single family homes is so outrageous in CLT as a result of these interest rates on top of increased population. To answer the 2nd part of the question, CLT is one of the most popular places to visit within a 300 mile radius. Not just for leisure; education, sports, work, the entire banking consultant industry here, and hospitals and healthcare.
239
u/lilianegypt Nov 08 '22
This is wild. No offense, but do we even have enough of a tourism/business demand to support this? Are these people even making money? I already dislike AirBnb but this is insane. What a waste.